SEO Presentation: Entrepreneur’s Guide to SEO
My name is Jason Khoo. I've done SEO and this is my fifth year doing it and I, you know, pretty much love the topic. Today's presentation when I'm doing what it mainly will be on is just the basics. As an entrepreneur or if you're the freelance consultant,this will pretty much get you started. So after this presentation, you should be able to go home tonight and start doing some SEO work. I like to keep things really casual, so if you have any questions, you know, feel free to just, ask away and then we can go ahead and go deeper or move on as fast as needed.
I started this as a sophomore in college. I knew, I knew I always liked marketing. I was lucky enough in high school to have the business program in my high school. So I got introduced really young and I knew I wanted to do it. But then when you get to college, I think we all have the same thing happen where you get kind of bored really fast the first two years are all GEs. You also like relearn things you learned in high school. But you know, when I went to college, people like Mark Zuckerberg and people had like reached their climax, they were blowing up the internet saying like, Oh, these are the guys to follow. And I was like the sophomore college, like still not being able to take a business class. So I got a little impatient, I knew a little bit of SEO based on a prior internship. And I always remember January 17, 2013, I bucked up, put a tie on and I went door to door on Chapman and State College, begging businesses saying, I'm a student. I know this skill. I'd really like to try it with your business. You know, if there's anything we can figure it out.
I can be intern, you know, small payments, whatever it may be. And that's how I got my start. So I've been doing it in the field for awhile and I've been applying this on real businesses. So you can be assured that this is not just some theory, this is the things I'm teaching you. I'm just getting rid of all the BS and making sure I show everyone what's the most important. Because my goal is not really to sell my services to anybody. My goal is to make sure that the understanding of the field increases because for some reason social media is really well understood and SEO is still is fairly misunderstood in a sense to a lot of people think SEO is bad because there's a lot of bad people doing SEO.
I pride myself on being the par part of the crew that has done it the right way, the correct way, the ethical way. And the proof isn't that in the five years I've done it, I've never had a single business drop in ranking. They've all maintained the ranking if not gone higher. So that's the kind of proof I have. If you want to see my Excel sheets here where the welcome to this is a little bit about me and my background. I am from Cal State Fullerton. I'm from the Mihaylo program. I actually wasn't in the entrepreneurship field, but I was very involved with the entrepreneurship community as an Entrepreneur Society. That's where I met Philip. We did a lot of stuff for four years. That was my main focus, just making sure that other students could start a business while and in addition to myself. And so I'm also part of the marketing program at Cal State Fullerton. This isn't a hit on Cal State Fullerton, but all the SEO I learned was not from the program. They don't teach this kind of stuff yet in the college. All of that had to be self study and internships, but like anything in this world, it's pretty much just self study. I have books on books and blogs.
I'm just going to keep going back to what you said about going door to door. How long did you do that?
Oh, I got, I got lucky in the first day, someone agreed. So I got the first client and then I started working with them. So I never had to go door to door again. I was deathly afraid that
Sure! And how long did you work with that one?
I worked with them until about two, three years. I didn't, I never got paid that well for, I was, I was still trying to learn business. I didn't feel confident to be asking for major payments, but then as I got more confident and you know, I grew a little bit he didn't want to pay.
And I guess your question reminds me, I need to tell you about what I do now. So I got lucky in my last year of college. I met my business partner who is a web designer, a graphic designer and a web developer. And he has 10 years of experience. But for himm he said for the first time ever, he lost two clients in a couple of months because his clients were being approached by marketing companies saying, we will do the graphic design and web design for free for you on our marketing contracts. He couldn't offer marketing with his graphic design cause he didn't know how to do it.
So we just met up and it's, it's worked out ever since.
So let's say if we're asking about marketing, we're asking him to do the SEO
Yeah. And he didn't know how to do it. And luckily for me, I knew it and I do have a background in photography and design but I just don't excel in it. So I try not to do it, but he handles all the design web design and everything. But I handle all the SEO strategy and it has just worked out really well. So I'm the typical story though, I went through I think three or three or four partners before I found him, which has really worked out.
But this is more an SEO talk than his entrepreneurship talk. So so today, like I said, feel free to ask any questions along the way with like today the here at the goal is we need you to rank at the top for Google, right? So there are times I may use jargon.
If you don't know what I'm saying, just raise your hand. Sometimes you forget what people do and do not know. There's a five step process. I pretty much use this presentation. We're just going to talk about SEO concept first and then go through the rest of keyword research, competitors, link building and best practices.
I don't like when people make marketing arbitrary, so I'm very like systematic about it. So you're going to see through today that you know, a lot of people say, Oh, branding, marketing, put yourself out there. But that doesn't really correlate with what we learn in business today, which is to have goals, have numbers that you can kind of stack up with. The SEO I kind of run will follow a more systematic system, I guess. So understanding SEO. Does everyone have a general understanding of SEO?
Does anyone not know what it is?
Okay, cool. I will assume that most people know. Well to kind of get a better idea. I like to always put it on the Google side rather than the consumer side. Consumer side is easy, you're just typing in something you want something to appear. But the best way to improve your SEO is to think from Google's perspective because essentially you're on Google's platform or Bing's platform and you understand why they would want to put you on the highest ranking.
So I always like to use the example of a library. If you had a library, right? Or a bookstore like Barnes & Nobles and you need to make sure that people find the best books because the best books, when people read the best books, they tend to get more books because they liked the book. And so someone says like of these three books, which books should we put in the front aisle while the rest of these go in the back? Cause you know, they always display the best books in the front. How would you know how if I, if I gave you these three books and I said, okay, which one are we going to put in the front? How would you kind of decide?
This is a question for all you guys.
It depends on who's searching for what, you know I may like a certain type of book or we made like a different type of book and he's going to want that book to show up first.
So in a, let's just imagine though that you opened the store and you can't dictate for each person the result. How would, how would you make sure that you get the best results with which book would you pick?
The book that has the words in it that I was looking for?
Don't think of it in the Google sense right now.
Just think of as a library and you have three books that's you're trying to put it, yeah. In the front.
Probably the most popular. Right? And how do you determine if something is popular?
Whatever is selling right?
So that means that's what's most talked about. Right? So the example I'm trying to get at is how Google understands it. Is that the book that is cited more is the one that's probably the most popular. The more that people talk about certain book, the more popular it is, the more it behooves you to put it in the front. A book that no one really talks about, you'd never heard anyone really say it to you. You're not going to put up front. Because now a lot of people talk about it. Well, and these examples thinking, grow rich is the most popular book of these three and most people are citing it, right?
You're saying sales people, a lot of people have, this book has sold a lot. I think they have like 85 million, if not more. A lot of people talking about it, you're going to put up in the front. So in a Google sense, now if we go back to the Google sense, you need to make sure that your website or whatever you're using is being mentioned the most, right? And so the connection is in reality with a bookstore, you just want to see, Hey, it's you. You can go to your friends. Which book of these three do you know? And you can do a survey, but generally you have a general understanding going through your life knowing that this certain book is more read than than another one, right? But how do you translate that to the online world? And the one thing I can say, it's links.
Links are the way that Google knows that you're being talked about, right? Because a link points from one website to another, right? And now imagine, let's imagine that we're not a library, but now we are Google and there are only three things that exist in the world. These three books and someone types in book the whichever book has the most links is pretty much going to rank number one. And that's something, this is a pretty raw basic way of thinking about it, but links is the Google's way of understanding what's most popular, right? Because it benefits Google to make sure that the best results goes to the searcher, right? That's why Google ended up beating Yahoo because Yahoo people always complain that Yahoo didn't have great results. But Google does. And Google ensures this by making sure that they provide you with the one that has the best, the most links going to it.
Later on the in the presentation, I'll go a little bit more in depth. It's a little bit more complicated, but for now this is a great way to kind of think about it. Is there any confusion on this example for now?
So Google is using this outlet space on some data.
Yeah. So they have, yeah, so they have these things called crawlers and they're like art spiders. I like calling co crawlers cause I hate spiders. But the goal rock has internet and they jumped from link to link. What did they find? A link? They jumped to that site. That site has links, it jumps and they just cause canvas the whole internet world. And they tally up everything along the way. Right. So you know, a lot of people when they think of SEO, because it's on the internet, I think they make it a little bit too complex.
I always like to tone it down to the real world. So if you're confused about why someone might be ranking better than you or you're trying to explain to someone, I always say use a real life example. It's nothing different. A link is like a human recommendation. The more recommendations a book has, the more popular it is. Same thing in the internet world. The more links you have, the more popular that is as well. Right.
So what do you think would be a significant amount of links to have coming in or linking in or what do you think might be a good good number to kind of shoot?
That's based on the competition. I would say for most small businesses, if you want to rank number one or two, even like one to two a month is good enough because a lot of what, what is, what is scary is that a lot of people think, Oh, online have so many people who beat me.
I don't want to do this. I think the best thing to experience is to go to all these businesses and ask them, Hey, when's the last time you updated your site? And most will say like three, four, five years ago, right? Which you can't blame them. It happens. We've all been there. But the person that, you know, every month there, they're going out there trying to get one or two links in, it adds up to 10 links, 10 links more than their competitor. There's 20 links. And what I would tell a lot of people is just take the small steps, right? Don't try to go for the home run. Don't, don't make the problem so big you'll, you'll get there. Right? And a lot. And you know, lots of small businesses don't even know what their site looks like. Right? So but I will, there's other ways to answer that question, but I'll go over later as well.
So to understand SEO is all well keywords and you guys are kind of mentioning it in the beginning. It's about what users are searching for. Well you can go online and they'll are probably dictionaries about keyword research. And a lot of people say you just spend as much time as possible on keyword research. I've done it for long enough to realize that you don't need to spend too much time. It's just a little bit of intuition and looking at data. The people who say you need to spend days and days of looking at keywords are the people who have, you know, multimillion dollar companies and you know, they're all over the world and they have a huge team. When it's just you helping up the local pizza shop, there are not that many keywords you need to be looking through because the sheer volume is just not that high.
The long tail is not worth it. But that reminds everything I talk about today is a free resource. Every I read everything I, you should have to be able to pay for anything. I did SEO without paying a dollar for the first four years of doing it and I reached a certain scale or that I had to start paying it. It made more sense. But for you guys, there are very few things that you need to be paying for. And it's kind of a debate about whether you really need an RA efficacy. But this next one is one I've used from day one. It's a Google AdWords keyword planner. Maybe you used it before. Yeah, it was kind of a, but to use, I kinda hate it, but as you start alerting it more, it becomes, you, you start learning how to use it faster.
But what you need for it is, this is kind of annoying when you use Google ad words, you have to use a unique email address. So if you have happened to ever sign up for Google ad words with your personal email, you have to create a whole new email. Let's make a new ad words account, right? So if you have multiple clients, you need to have a specific email for each one of them. And this is what sucks the most. If you've created an account with an email, but you want to delete that account and start up, start all over again. You can't, they have to be unique. I've tried everything I've called Google. They have to be unique, right? So when before you create an account, make sure you log it down, make sure that you're committed to the email and it's pretty easy. You could always just put like ad-words the client's email@example.com. The only thing that is you need to have a unique count for Google ad words.
Okay. Why do you need the you to kick off? I'll say for example, if someone has different websites, they can put in different keywords for each one opinion going what they're doing. I'm not clear on why you say
So what I'm saying is so ad-words because advertising platform and there's a lot of money going back and forth. Google wants to make sure that it's a one account to one credit card to,
Oh, you mean if you paying for it? No, I'm not looking at it app. So if you're paying then they want you to happen. Okay.
It's just because the platform itself is so large and you can pay for it. You guys don't have to pay. But that leads me to a second point. You need to put a credit card on file. You will never be charged in my law. I've never been charged for any of it. But you just need to have one on file for them as well. And then you need an Excel Google docs platform because you need to be able to export everything. Now so how to navigate to Google ad words. You just type in Google AdWords or Google AdWords keyword planner. When you go to, you're going to go to a page that looks like this after you've signed up. This is a personal account. I have that. I don't use it ever, but this is what's going to look like. And you're going to see this orange bar across the top.
That's that. That shows that you're not paying for anything. He'll say none of your ads are running, but you have a credit card on file. If you don't want to pay for anything you need, you should be able to see the orange bar. If you don't see that orange bar, you're paying for ads. So make sure you see the orange bar there. So to get to the keyword planner, you hover over tool or click on it and you're gonna see keyword planner. It's where the green arrow is right there. And from there, that's where all the power is. This is the basis of every SEO campaign I've ever run from here is where you get access to Google's database of how many how many people are searching, searching for certain keywords. So I always use Google keyword planner. There are other tools out there.
This is probably the by by far the most popular, but going from here it's kind of blurry, huh? Well the only thing you need Google AdWords is famous for being complicated to use. They're just, they haven't been seen as a user friendly as much, but the only thing you need to know are these two areas. There's one area on the here, keyword entries, search for keywords using a phrase, sorry, go ahead. So as a search for a key words or phrases, you can enter as many keywords as you like. I just make sure you make sure you add a comma or at least a press enter between each of them. My recommendation, use an Excel sheet first and then copy and paste it into the bar. I mean the table, it makes it a lot easier. So all you gotta do is enter it here.
You're going to see like your landing page. You don't really need to put any of that. The only one I would deal with was this top one. There are negative keywords too. Don't either worry about either. So just worry about putting in your own keywords. A little bit of a token, a note. If you want to kind of power your SEO a little bit more. Sometimes you don't know what your keywords are, but you know who your competitors are. And then your landing page section, you can actually put your competitors a website in here and Google will show you the keywords that, that they're kind of going for. So it's a, it's a really good tool to kind of see what competitors are doing. I don't use it too much, but sometimes you, you, you, you're new to a client's business.
You don't understand what keywords are being used. They might though. So it's a good way to also understand that better. And this is the most important part. All right, so down here there's a table called targeting. You can target the geographic region and this is where it gets extremely powerful when you go to class or you read on articles and say, talk about the power of geographic targeting with the digital marketing. This is, this is what I'm talking about. You can kind of add location you want. It can be based on city counties, state or the nation or the globe as a whole. Right? typically what I do is I do it on a, on a city level or County level. Orange County though it might be too big. So if you're doing it for a business in orange County, orange County is one of the most competitive counties in the country for anything.
So I typically just pick four or five cities in a surrounding area, right? And that will make sure that the data they have spits out to you is only based on those geographic regions from those searchers in those geographic regions. You can do language, Google all languages or anything, but I don't see anybody needing to play with languages. That's pretty much it. So remember it's just search for new keywords and target. It's just these two right here. Other than that, don't press any of the other buttons because you don't need it. You really don't. You, yeah, you really don't like this. Is there another source? There are, but a lot of them are paid. Google keyword planner is one of the only free ones. When I say I don't like using it, I mean that more in like a unknowing, but I love it at the same time because Google AdWords, well, a lot of people have gripes about it is that it updates a lot and they'll change where the buttons are.
But I've used keyword planet for so long that this has stayed stable and I would encourage you to Google keyword planner because because Google is the most used search engine by far, I you want to use their data set more than any other company because other companies can have their data sets, but at the end of the day, they're using some variation of Google's data set as well. Right? so once you answer in your keywords, this is what it's gonna look like. And I'll kind of show and I'll kinda cover with you how to read it. I read this, no, it's just for Meditechs or we're doing a keyword search. So yeah. So kinda to give you a basis understanding this is the step you take before you do anything, you want to know what you want to rank for. And so the reason why you're doing this is because when you enter into any business, do you think, you know what words you should kind of target, but you want, you want to F you want to check the data, right?
So you know, an example I like to use is what I, I just recently signed a solar company and they do solar installations to them. They're technical, they, they're engineers. They understand you know, full photo voltaic cells and all these different things, but the consumers don't. So you need to understand what people are searching into Google. So this is not really to define anything. This is just more to understand what keywords you should have to work with. And there are people out there who say, pick 50 to 60. I'm in the kind of school of thought you should just pick five to 10 as a small business and go from there. Right? so let's you put in your keywords and I put in three bubble tea, frozen yogurt Boba. Otherwise, I always use this example because when I was in college, I want to start a Boba shop.
You still might wanna we'll see. What else fit out is the keywords that you've added, terms that you add these keywords already and they add, they split them out here. The average amount they searches competition and the suggested bid. The reason why this is a suggested bid and competition is because remember, this is on Google ad words. And so this is what other people who are buying ads are, are paying. So this is the suggested bid. The kind of give you a scale to kind of work with any suggested bid under $5. It's not that competitive. It's definitely do anything, any suggested bids under a dollar, the market is wide open. Nothing should be under a dollar. If you see something that's suggested bid at 47 cents, the market's open for that. So you go for it, right? Anything that's above $10 is starting to get competitive.
Not impossible. But if you start seeing things like 50 to $75 that's, you're playing with the big boys. And to kind of give you understand. And when you do, grew out of Russ, I know we were not talking about ad words, it just to help you read this. What do you do? Google ad words. You pay per click of the ad. You don't pay for the ad showing, you pay only when someone clicks on it, right? So the suggested bid is what Google is saying, how much you should pay for each click, right? So if you're willing to pay $75 a click, that means you're, you got a budget to work with. If you're under 10, it's understandable, right? So that's kinda to give you an understanding of that. But the number of that means the most to you is average monthly searches.
You're low, you're targeting should have something here that says, well, the cities you picked for this example, I didn't put any geographic zones, but it'll give you, it'll spit out the number of average monthly searches. What do you do from here is you can just download it. You see us download a Dell to Excel or Google docs file and you'll have it on file. So what you want to do that is you, it's pretty self explanatory from here, from all the keywords you've kind of looked at, find the one with the highest searches and see if it makes sense for you. And you go for that. And what'd you start doing is you start implementing that into your site, right? So I love to use this as an example because on the West coast we call a the product Boba Boba. But on the East coast they call it bubble tea, right?
So you need to ensure that what do you have zone you're at, what's the more popular term, right? So if you were to launch a boa business in the East coast, you need to make sure you're using bubble tea instead of Boba cause you're not gonna, you're not allowed. People are searching for it. And the geographic targeting will tell you that, right? Because I didn't have space on the screen. If you scroll down, Google will give you hundreds and hundreds of recommended recommended keywords. I suggest you look through them because they what, how Google determines the recommendations is that when people type in this search term, how many of those saved people searched another search term of equal relevance? I would definitely kind of go through that. So to kind of walk you through. What you should do is when you, so you go in there, you put your keywords in that you think you want to use, right?
You have the numbers here, Google will spit out another 300 for you. Go through the whole list, gather a list of about 50 and 60 then, and there's a button right here, says add to plan. You just press this button and you add a Google. We'll save it for you. Just download that plan. It'll be, it's right there on the screen for you. And then put on an Excel file and kind of look through the list, see the average monthly searches, and then using your intuition and not just data, decide which ones are the ones you want to focus on. And like I said last time, I have to probably tell people to focus on five, five to 10 because five to 10 is should get you to where you need if you're trying to, if you're trying to optimize for 60 he was at the same time. Be everyone in this audience here isn't trying to be an SEO master, you're more likely trying to manage a business at the same time. You don't have the time to be managing 60 keywords. And even from my company when I matched for clients, I don't do more than 10 keywords at a time. Really. So key Google keyword planner is a little bit complex. If we have time in the end, I'd be happy to just pull up on my computer and kind of walk you through it. Yeah.
Okay. When you say five to 10 keywords, or what about if there's a phrase like, you know, might have two or,
Yeah, I know, I love that you use the example. I was hoping someone would ask that. So what might happen sometimes I'm use like a pizza. I love pizza. You could try to target the word pizza, right? But what about pepperoni pizza or pepperoni white cheese pizza or you know, sausage pizza, right. I typically don't like people targeting two phrases that are like two or three words deep because you should just be targeting word pizza because pieces in that phrase. Now if you start optimizing for the word pizza, once someone types in pepperoni pizza, you'll appear because the word pizza in there. Right? But if you go chasing the whole phrase, it's like a swing and a swing and a miss sometimes.
Does that kind of make it? Yeah. Let's say, let's just say you do have a choice of [inaudible] pepperoni pizza. Either use a pepperoni pizza. The one with pepperonis that were wings out. Yeah, that would, the one with pepperoni may win. So I like, yes, that's actually becoming a good point. So the way you should think about it then is this is what I like to go to the business itself or if you're the business owner yourself, what products make you the most money? I always ask that in my meetings. I said, well, which products or which service makes you the most money? And we're going to focus on that one because like with pizza there's like 80 different combinations. But if you know pepperoni makes and she's making you the most, then yeah, pick pizza, pepperoni, pizza, cheese, pizza, breadsticks and I don't know. Like I say my pizza Palo is specializing it dish.
Yeah, so except competing greens. Everybody else. If the guy slash fish if I mean, yeah, but that's the caveat. You need to make sure people are actually looking for our deep dictation because there's one thing that SEO does not do well. SEO does not do well with new products because new products are not being searched for because they're new. When when the Apple iPod came out, no one is searching for iPod, right? They're searching for MP three player, so it might benefit. Apple did have optimized for MP three player rather than iPod because no one knows the term iPod, so you need to, that's what I mean. Meaning intuition a little bit with it. You can't just look at straight data, but if you have a specialty item, yes, go for it. But the number of searches has to be worth it. The lowest a number you can get on who I would want to spit it back out is 10 if you get, if your main five keywords are 10 each for average monthly searches, that's another good sign you need to have it.
And let's say you just did one city, let's say we just did four 10 you need something at least 50 50 is a great number. If you just took one city. Now if you keep adding cities, just kind of multiply on top, but anything that's less than 50 it doesn't seem worth it. But with the whole scale, you'll be able to start understanding it when you see like a hundred keywords at one time, and if you just clicked the the top panel, it'll organize everything based on the most amounts or just to the searches. Right? So, but I liked that you bring that point. Remember, SEO is not, I always say, well, I'm an SEO guy. I don't create demand. I meet demand, right? I don't create, you can't create demand on SEO because it's users searching, right? You can't, you can't make them type a term that they don't know, right.
So you kind of have to strategize it with your whole biz operations because a lot of people will say like, Oh, I want to optimize my business names with this cool products. So this, I'll, I'll like Joe's Joe Bob's bicycle, they would optimize for that. Right. But no one's going to search that because it's such a niche term that's unique to them, has to be more generalized. Right. so do you look for like Los Angeles is a really big city. Yeah. so would you look say, okay, instead of LA, maybe I would look at like a small little hole. Yeah. You could do like silver Lake and yeah, I, my recommendation, pick three to five cities in a, in a zone. One city is usually too small. So you need to do a three to five cities and you can stack the cities. You're gonna stack the cities.
So this is the tool I highly recommend, but sometimes you just don't want to, you just want to do a quick look at two keywords. Right. I, the other tool I would recommend is Google trends, another Google product. Google trends to me is the most underrated tool of Google's arsenal. Then like a lot of people don't take advantage of. All you gotta do is you gotta type in Google trends and you see, you can add up to five keyword terms and it'll give you the average searches in whatever zone you want based on, I think it's, I think the smallest you can get is for Google translate is the country. I don't think you can do city, but it just gives you a really quick look at what term is more popular. So for example you could also use this for like demand research.
You know what, back in the day when I was trying to do the Boba shop, part of my pitch was that if you look over time Bobo's the rat frozen yogurts, the blue and at the end of 2015, Boba actually overtook frozen yogurt in terms of searches, which shows a seismic shift in the market. That Boba is actually snapped being soft sod more than frozen yogurt is right. You can also use a simply, maybe I can just put bubble tea instead of Boba. See which one is being used more. Google trends is just a lot faster way to look at key was a little bit quicker, but you can't really download an Excel sheet. They're not giving you exact numbers. Everything is based on just relativity. Well we will, Edwards gives you the ag Zack, the exact monthly searches. So I would say you Google trends that you're just sitting at your computer and you're like writing a blog post or you're writing a title.
You don't really want to spend a couple of hours looking at Heuer planner. So you're just like, should I use this word or that word? Throw it in here really quick and I'll tell you the answer. So that's actually just reminded me too. When you go to a keyword planner, when you're looking at the average monthly searches the, the, the world's not perfect. And why, why I say that is because of the, because it's average. The give and take on what is actually is as 40% up or down. That's just how it is. You kinda have to take that with a grain of salt. But you just look at the number and you just know it might change, but there's no way you can actually like exactly estimate what the exact amounts going to be, but just know that's be 40% higher or it can be lower than that.
So that's Google trans. It also will give you a map based on where that term is used more. So this is a I L I love using this for any phrases that might get called into question, like some people say pop instead of soda. This will kind of kind of show you if you're, if you don't really know what people, what words people are using, the darker the blue, the more heavier it is being used in that state. Can you use this to see who's going to your website? For example, can you put like a website name in there? No, it won't. It won't do that. Yeah, you'd have to use a Mox for that kind of stuff. So the, the, those last two tools are for the basis of SEO. That's just, it gets you start and off the ground to make sure that the words you pick for your website are the right ones to use, right?
Because there are so many words that we can use. A Google keyword planner allows us to decide which keywords we should focus on, right? Because you want to be using the right keywords from the beginning because if you don't, you have to rewrite everything and start off like can start all over again. You want to make sure you put in the time to research it in the beginning. Are we all kind of understanding that the keyword part of it? I don't have to kind of go over why keywords are important, right? We all understand that the relationship Google index is based on the keyword. Okay. So this is something that I feel really strongly about and that's assessing the competition. It's cool as you know, your keyword, it's cool that you have your website, but that's where a lot of entrepreneurs stop.
They just think like, Oh, I have my website, I know the keywords, the keywords on my site, I should be good. It doesn't really work like that. What I always advise people is every keyword you chose, so hopefully five and 10 put it in Google and see who ranked them. The top 10 right? This is, this is where I say I like to be more systematic about it. Let's understand the results. Let's see who pops up first. So I want to throw some SEO concepts on you there. I promise you, I'm not trying to inundate you with too much technical knowledge, but if you know this, it will make your SEO. It will translate SEO from ambiguity to actually specifics. So just kind of follow with me here. Did we all know what page rank used to be? We all know what page rank is.
Okay. Google used to operate with this a scoring system called pantry and page rank on a scale of one to 10 and they would rank every site they found on a scale of one to 10 and which when you're, when you were going for a keyword, they would just see who had the highest page rank and put it based on the higher, the higher the page rank and the higher the result. Correct. A couple of years ago, Google annihilated that. They took it out because they knew that people figured out about page rank and so they've taken it out. Now the online community has adopted a new page rank called domain authority. Right? Domain authority is a number a scale based from one to a hundred so it's not that complicated. It's just like a ratio from page rank, Pedro, it was a one to 10 domain authority was to this one to a hundred if you want to know kind of where you should be looking at for your website, if, if you're a small business, 20 to 30 is great.
2030, she gets you the top rankings. Anything a lower than 10 you we need, we need to work a little bit harder to get above 10. To kinda give you a scale understanding, Cal state Fulton has a domain authority of 77. They're, they're an educational institution though. They're massive. BBC New York times, they have a domain authority of like 90. So that kind of gives you an understanding of where everyone's at. Most local businesses will have nine, nine to 18. That's why I say 20 or 30 is pretty good for a small business. Medium sized businesses a little typically have like 50, 60. But domain authority is a great way for you to understand your placement. Yes. Do you find out what their domain name? We're going to get to that in two seconds. Right. So one of the next free tools I want you guys to all take advantage of is called the MozBar.
It's the online community. The MAs is like the Sage, the master of SEO. They sell SEO software, but they are credited with the creative. One of the first communities of SEO and they created something. You've got to use Chrome for this toolbar, but it's a Chrome bar. Mozbar and what it'll do is that you guys can see it right here when you type into Google and it'll give you the pain authority, the domain authority will tell you how many links the top result has. The second was all has that way, it gives you a number to work off of. I know I should've picked a better example because these, these are national keywords, but this is what happened. I think one, 1 million, eight, 800 800,000 links, right? So you have a number to go off of. Their domain authority is 88.
So clearly they're a dominant force. But what I like about this is that SEO is all about rankings, but a lot of the people don't know how to get to the top page because they don't even know the strength of their competitors. And I'm a big believer in, you know, the military warfare, you'll know your enemy better than you know yourself. You need to understand where your competitors are being placed and why they're there, that you need to look at their domain authority and the amount of links going in direct page authority and debates are, the only difference is each page on your website has a different page authority, but there's a single domain authority for your whole website. I'm pretty sure everyone gets that aspect of it. So I would highly recommend you use MozBar it. They will show us a, an M on the top of your browser and you can go onto any website, click the button and it'll spit up the domain authority for you. Right. And there's a lot more awesome stuff to it too. But for the sake of this, I just kind of want to focus on domain authority and that way this gives you a roadmap. You know, it's like everyone's like, Oh, I just want to rank higher. Higher doesn't mean anything unless you have other people to compare higher with,
Yeah. It's a, yeah, a Chrome app that you can just download. T the one disclaimer I will put is that I'm a paid user of Moss. And so the toolbar, if you're a paid users, a lot more powerful. I've never used it on a free subscription, but I do know it does spit out the domain authority. So it may, there are certain things that you may not be able to see, but I know for sure domain and paint authority is something you can see and model says a 30 day free trial if you want to see beyond that as well.
Can I move on to next time? So I'm sorry, go ahead. Yeah.
So would you say MozBar is also like Alexa toolbar or would you use them? Would you choose one over the other or, yeah. You don't, to be honest, I don't use Alexa ever. I've heard a lot about Alexa when I was you right? Like learning about SEL. But I will admit, I don't think Alexa is used that much anymore because I think it's more of a, it just tells you like, I think I just used MozBar I don't, I would recommend Mazor Alexa. Yeah, I don't think I like says use it as much. [inaudible] De SEL. All right, cool. So that's to understand who your the competitors. So like I said, type in those keywords into Google, see who wrecks top 10, and it starts seeing the domain authority. So that gives you a, an understanding. So like if you know your sites is five and your competitor has a, has a domain authority of eight, you know, you're not far behind. Mozbar is the Mazda. The domain authority is not updated every day though. So it's not like a every day you can just see it updates every, I think one or two months. So you do have to have some patients, but if you're doing SEO, it's, it's a, it's a patient game. I always say SEO is like farming. You kind of just have to plant some seeds and you know, you did everything right. And just hope that it comes out of the ground is there's no way just incrementally see everyday changes.
Okay, I'm that good lane authority. Is there any, cause I'm just saying, let's say for example, you know, purchase your domain name long time ago, that's going to get a higher ranking. That's something, you know, cause we're looking at [inaudible], I think Google calls it history. So if that person, let's say purchase their domain name in 2000, they're going to get a higher ranking to somebody they purchased theirs recently
In a vacuum. Yes. But that's eliminating all other factors. But yes, that has a ranking factor, but let's say like the newer site has a way more links going into it than a will that says some have a higher positioning. Right? So, so what artifact of second mall? There are thousands of factors. Yeah, there are thousands. And that's why I say I want to focus on links and keywords because those two are the most dominant. There are factors like mobile usage, mobile, like can it be used on mobile? Does it have a mobile site? The site structure I'll, I kind of go more into that later, but there are thousands of them. But what I always say is links as the number one and keywords is number one. Those are the top two. So legs, any, anytime anyone comes to you and says, Oh well you know that you're not doing this right though. That's when you get really nitpicky and it's okay to be nitpicky. But when you're, when you're just a small business startup in a local area, being nitpicky, is this going to slow you down? You just need to kind of go for the big fish cause the big fish will get you there just like that. Right. Some people try to focus too much on these small details. Just focus on the big fish right now.
Well one of the hardest things is to get people to link back to you though. Do you have any suggestions on
Yes, I will get to that. In a couple slides. Yeah. so an obstacle I think that everyone should use is rank checker. I don't mean to make it complex, but rank checker is only able, you can only use rank checker on a Mozilla. It's not available in any other platform Chrome or internet Explorer. You have to use Mozilla. But the reason why I would highly recommend you use it is because can you imagine having 10 keywords you've chosen now and 10 competitors and you're going to try typing it in every month to like look through them. That would be a big pain in the butt. What range checker will do is you just put in the keywords on the left side and it will find the rankings of all your competitors and your own domain for those keywords. I'll split it up now.
I put it won't look like that exactly cause I always export it to an Excel sheet. But I would highly recommend you use just UDA to, to play with it because it makes your life 10 times easier for SEO. A lot of the people, what they try to do is they type in the keyword and then they look for themselves. That's a very inefficient way to do it, especially when you're trying to track your progress and your competitors. So this is an example I would, you know, really recommend, I've been using this from day one. So this is something I recommend everyone to use in terms of organization is just efficiency. Yeah.
Mozilla Firefox, Mozilla, yeah. And it's called the rank checker as yeah. I will provide the PowerPoint and I'll have a link. So if you don't remember just go into my PowerPoint, I'll have it linked. So just click the link and I'll go right there. Really is a lifesaver to be honest. If you talk to other SEO people, some of them will say tracking your rankings is stupid. Because you know, because Google personalized searches for everybody, it tends to be different for everybody, your ranking. But to me, I really believe that it does matter because yeah, sure that for you, a CSUF might be in a psych listing, but for me it's the fourth listing. As long as I have an average understanding, I'm okay with that. These numbers may fluctuate based on the user, but generally from what I've seen from the years I've been doing, it is pretty like average.
Correct? It's usually correct. Right. And it's just a great way for you to kind of see your improvements. A lot of people say, Oh, you don't even need to check your rankings if you're not checking your rankings. And sometimes I, I want to ask, how do you know where you're at then? Right? Because some people say all depends on traffic. But you're ranking really dictates traffic as well though. So that's not so I would highly recommend everyone to use. So increasing your rankings. We've talked a lot about how to track your rankings. Now this is the big gold part, which is how to increase your rankings. Now, I know I said earlier, there are thousands of different things that dictate your rankings. These are the six I think are the most popular and the most discussed about link building, number one by far.
Number one, they are there. Our entire profession is devoted to link building. I will, the end of this presentation is devoted Lake building, so don't worry about that one. Mad data. The amount of times, that's what a Philip was talking about. That's your title ties and med descriptions. I'm not going to go over today because I don't think we have the time. And the reason why I chose to leave that one out because that one is easy to find info really quick online. Just type in title tags, med descriptions, and you'll find enough info just like that. Right? So that's why I'm going to go with that one today because it's so easy to find. The one caveat. A lot of people like stuffing keywords into meta tags. So there's something called title tags and descriptions and med tags. And if you look at any websites, a page source, there's something called meta tags.
Med tags are not looked at anymore. So a lot of people say, Oh, I put my SEO and I put the mad tagline. I think like five years ago, Google announced that they're not going to look at med tags anymore because too many people were just stuffing it with as many keywords as possible. So if you want, if you ever hired an SEO person or you're talking to an SEO person or someone who's acting like they know everything about SEO, I kinda like to throw it out there like, Oh, so what about this med tax? And if they say like, Oh, I was just, I put all the metal tags in, they don't, they have, they don't know their SES because as med techs are not checked by Google, they don't even look at them anymore. They have no ranking factor whatsoever. So don't let anyone tell you I did your SEO, I put them in attacks. Then really what they're saying is I just did nothing
Right after I talk. Let's say for example with the meta title, when you look at Google, it actually calls whatever you have in the medical.
Yeah. So there's title tags, meta descriptions and met attacks. So the title tag and the MediScripts are still checked. The meta tag is not checked.
And then a web traffic, mobile friendly content marketing, social I don't like putting social on there. Yes, soulful is a ranking factor, but the amount of ranking factor it actually has is very minimal. And a lot of people don't know this, but whenever you have a link going from Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, or any of the social medias into a website, Google does not contribute any ranking factor to that. So they, they see the link but they don't add any additional like rank for you. Because the reason why they do that do that as a, there's two schools of thought, one, Google and Facebook arrivals that Google is not going to let Facebook try to help them, like with the rankings. And two, it's just too easy to game on Facebook. You can, you can just put links in every post and it'd be easy to game system. So they actually, they call it, they call them no follow links, which means that you tell people, yes, I'm linking there, but we're not going to give them any ranking added raking juice, reg, raking, inherit pushup. So when you're trying to do SEO, when you're putting your link on Facebook, it's not actually, it's not actually really doing anything.
Okay, cool. So we're gonna talk about link building. I know earlier I was talking about links and how the sheer volume of links matters, but I kind of have a graphic to kind of discuss the, so not all links are made the same. And the reason why that matters now is because there were too many people in this world who are crediting websites just to put thousands of links. So we called those link farms. I'm going to go back to that example with the library. If you know a world renowned author and he's a great writer and he recommends a book to you, his word is a lot stronger than the average person because he is seen as an authority, right? That same model falls into SEO. If you have a thousand links, but they're all from a thousand blogs that only have one post, right, or you have one link from time magazine feature article, that time magazine article, it will actually bump you higher than those 1,001 links because time magazine has a bigger authority.
So I actually made the artists, me made a graphic, kind of understand it. This one has the most circles, which are links. Circles represent links. This one has the most circles, but in it altogether, it doesn't mean it has a bigger size, but if you look at this top one, it has the fewest links, but it has high authority links and that bumps it up high. So not all links are made the same. So the higher the domain authority of a site that links to you the better. Right? So if you're getting links from 50s forties 50s great. If you're only getting links from eight, seven, six sites, your, your ranking is a little increase, but not by much because the Google, they're saying, yeah they're getting recommended, but it's by all these small dinky little sites and can we really trust those sites?
Right? But they're saying, wow, look at this guy, they're getting mentioned by Forbes, time magazine, a New York time. Kelsey folds is talking about them. If you are Google, you know, you would make that same decision that that one company being meshed by the major publications should be bumped up higher. So when you're, when you're going out there looking for links, do not go for the sheer volume. Go for the equality and the authority of those links, right? So the Holy grail of links is.edu and.gov if you can get.edu and.gov site, it is wonderful for your rankings because Google sees those domains as high, high trust and high authority, right? So I always say it with the Cal state force when people try to get calcium folds to write an article about you, cause there are diets when it comes to [inaudible] dot EDU article are raking shot up to right.
So if you've tried to LeBron what you got, if you got a kind of friend in a college or dug up, tried to get like that's number one priority. And sometimes what governments or cities will do is they'll have a try to get on there, try to get on that directory because there are.gov or.edu. So like I said, not all links are made the same. Now saying that I can say yes, you want to get a link to a time magazine, how to, how to get that link as a whole nother story. So you know, I don't want to sound like I'm jumping back and forth. So yes, go for those awesome domain names. But what I would say is you should not focus 100% of your time because that's like trying to get a home run every time at bat.
It's just your chances are so low, you need to kind of build slowly. Even with this big one, they have the small guys, right? So there are different there are things that I always do with every client to get links. Number one is directories. Directories are the low hanging fruit of the SEO world. Caveat directories are though like a small circles, they're not the most strongest thing in the world because directories at the end of the day are just link farms essentially. But with higher authority, we'll go for directories and everyone just thinks of Yelp, Google, yellow pages. There are hundreds of them, right? And in every niche, there are directories of those niche, right? So in every car I've ever had, and it doesn't stop on Yelp. In the solar industry, there are thousands of solar directories in horseback riding. There's crews everywhere and you can find them. It's as simple as typing in, let's say you own a pizza shop, pizza directories, and Google should spit out some directories for you. And that's where you try to add your listing. So that's a great way to start. It shouldn't be your main strategy, but when you just want to see a little bit of bump, you want to start moving the waves a little bit. Go to directories.
For me, the second one blogs is the unsung hero of Casio. I think not enough people give blogs credit or look at logs, but with technology being so much easier to access and blogs being so easy to make, I really think everybody should go for blogs, right? Because there are hundreds of people who wants to review restaurants or review products, right? And a business going to them, offering them a product to review it, like strokes. There you go. But you get a link out of it, you get more exposure and it's just a lot easier than trying to go to a journalist and being like, please write a cover story about me. But then to like 10 bloggers who, who are like, Hey, I know you blog every week, can I, can you, do you want to come in and try this out? Right? So I highly recommend go for the blogs and you go for the niche blogs too.
So just like how I said every industry has its own directories. Every industry has his own blog as well. Orange County has the the strongest mob blog contingent in the world. Right? And so if you have a product that's for kids, boom, go there. Right. And you know, you have to always think about it from their perspective too as bloggers, they need something that's eye-catching that's interesting for them. So if you can kind of work with your client on making something interesting that they can review, great. Right? And what a lot of people are afraid of and actually wrote a lot of blog posts about this as well as people say bad things about me. The first thing I'll say usually have a bloggers on like what they got. They won't write anything. Usually they'll just tell you, Hey, we didn't like it.
We're not going to write about it. Because a lot of bloggers actually don't want to be negative on their blog to their muse. Like you, you have a blog, you don't want to be screaming at people like, Oh this person sucks. Cause it kind of lowers the value of your authenticity. And the second thing I always say is if you're afraid to put your product out there because of negative reviews, then you're probably just doesn't deserve to even be there. You need to take that risk. Right? so till this day, I still haven't had a single person. The publication would be like writing us a bad review on their blog posts. They either send it back or they're just like, you know, we didn't like it. Once I, sponsorships, I don't like I put that on there because you never know what you got.
But sponsorship does require money. But if you can sponsor a local, a charity event, that's always great. And sometimes you can sponsor them by not even giving them money. You can just make a buyer. I would highly recommend bars. Bars are the best way to get links and trade associations. So if you can get a chamber of commerce, you know, to, to link to you, that's great. And so what I know is a chamber of Commerce's is that they're their own entities as well. And they need help. So for one of my clients, I got them into the chamber of commerce for free because we helped like, you know, help them with event where the client offered them some free stuff and everything worked out and we started getting links like that. So that's pretty much the five main ones. At the end of the day, link building is something you just got to roll up your sleeves and go fly.
But like I always say with SCO, do not make it something super complicated. It's just like the real world. It's just like the real world of networking linking is like having their business card. If you can make a great impression with them and work with them because you should be feel at like, and you can be as creative as you want with it. For example, there are always complimentary businesses, services and products to your business, right? You can always work with a complimentary business trying to get a link. So I'm going to give you the example we're using right now, which is the solar company. Through my research, I understood, I started understanding that solar company is one of the major obstacles is that they against all on people's homes, right? And people are afraid of the, the, the value of their home, how's going to affect the mortgage and everything like that.
So we decided to go to real estate companies and say, why don't we work on joint content on your blog? We'll, we'll be guest writers on there and on our blog you can guess around ours so that people who come to our website can see from both perspectives, right? And that, and that's when link-building gets not so isolate like, Oh, I've got one link here, I've got one link here. The best links are business partnerships. If you can partner with a complimentary business, say there's this thing that a lot of customers are talking about, why don't we together make content? You're going to get five to 10 just like that, right? And that way it's more fun. It makes more sense for your business. I don't really recommend going at, I want at some point we all have to just try to find each link.
But if you can just create partnerships, it's a lot better. That's why I sometimes I like telling people if you can find something like the chamber of commerce or even this incubator they'll host, what they usually do is they always host new events every year, five, seven events every year. If your business decides to go, guess who's links on that event page your business. And that's five links a month. Five links a year, right? And if you go to the event, you might meet more people, more linking opportunities. Another example I like to always tell people is if you ever get featured by a blog, milk it. When I got peaches by Cal state Fullerton, put the seal of calcium folds and on your website, right? And so that way when you go to another blog or another publication, you can say, Oh yeah, we got featured on Cal state Fullerton and we think the product would be great for your blog too, right? So you kind of really have to be creative with link-building. But at the end of the day, I can tell you, I've read as many online articles and books as I possibly can about link building and there is no way to just pass a week, get them right. You need to be able to go out there. And I always say it's just networking the online version, no network, build a great product and then people will talk about you.
Yeah. You for like a number on like how many directories you tried to link to or blogs or directories. 30 is a good number, 30 is a great number to have. And then it depends on the size. If I think a small business, if they can get three to five blog posts about them from a, from another blog a year, you're way ahead of, than everybody else. That's what I, I, I kinda think, Oh, I don't know why I didn't make a slide for this. But when you're doing SEO, you should see your first ranking fluctuation in the first six to six to eight weeks. No, I'm sorry, eight to 10 weeks. Sorry, I haven't flipped it. It's eight to 10 weeks is when you just see your first fluctuation. After the first eight to 10 weeks, you should see the rankings start improving by a lot.
But the first, those first eight weeks you, you probably won't see much happening. So that's why I say SEO is like farming. You could just kind of know that you did the right thing and that the eighth or 10th week it'll, it'll happen. Why? Because Google is not updating their their stuff that, that, yeah, they don't have the server strength yet, but eight to 10 weeks, if you don't see change after eight to 10 weeks you just start wrapping up the SEO work. Not so much anymore because hopefully the work you were originally doing has some movement. Right. but like I always just, just if you're, if you're nervous, put more work in. Right. But if you're a small business like a brick and mortar location in orange County and you're just trying to try to target your local city and you're not an insurance real estate or solar or anything like that, 30 directories start blogging. Once a week, two times a month should be good enough, I'd say. Because the, I have a client in Newport beach, they, their gym, Newport, beautiful. That club, we don't have any bloggers, Riley writing about us. All we did was we updated the directory, is updated, the keywords, made the site nicer with content. He blogged every week and now we're the number one gym in Newport beach. We'd be the Equinox. We'd beat a 24 hour fitness. Right.
I'm sorry, you said three to five or a year or how many, Oh, sorry. Okay. I should've been more specific. Three to five blog blogs like external blogs who are, who are writing about you. Okay. For blogging yourself. If you can get two a month, I think you're set. But like I always say, I don't like to give numbers on a vacuum. I like, you need to look at your competitors. If your competitors blogging weekly, then okay, you need to probably match it or whatnot. But what I wouldn't, I would not ever be deterred by is a lot of people get deterred by like, Oh, I have an Equinox in my city, or I have a pizza hut. Well, a lot of these people, they're franchise owners, they're not gonna have the time to do that kind of stuff. So essentially we're not competing against Equinox, the corporation, we're just competing against that one office, right?
And we beat them out because they weren't doing anything on their site. And if I could just add more Google ranking factors, the more site is updated, the more Google likes it, right? So it just shows Google that you care about the customer that you're trying to be as up to date as possible. So that's a good way to do it. But when you do link build, I would highly recommend you to keep an Excel sheet. I always like to put an Excel sheet. You put the name of the, the, the place. I'm trying to add a link, put a date and put what you did because let me tell you, after three years of trying to do it by memory, you forget so fast. We'll link to, you're trying to build and sometimes links will be easy to get. We'll say, Oh, add your business. And you're like, Oh, that was easy. Sometimes you have to literally email them or call them and say, Hey, I saw you have this. Can we add ourselves on there as well?
Okay. My question is, because you said something about earlier about me forums, there are no more. So basically when you're doing these blogs, ever mentioning your company and they're mentioning it as a hyperlink back to your website.
Yes, correct. But what you, yeah, so that's, that's what you want. You want a natural organic link to your, to your site. So hopefully that blog post was talking about a great product you put out or there's a local event in the community and your business is going to be there. What you don't want is a blog saying, if you pay me $10, I'll, I'll put your link in a, in a list of links because Google does not like that because
Do you have a directory though? It doesn't.
Yeah, if it's, if it's a directory then yes, but it's I test, right? If the site looks not that trustworthy, you kind of don't want to do it. But if it's like a yellow pages site or a looks well-built, of course there are a, the other day I looked at a blog devoted to pet pigs and they had directory, but you have to kind of do a little, this shouldn't take you more than three minutes, but look at the directory. They look at the size of the hole. Is it well put together or is it just that one page with the links, right. If it looks like a site that is devoted to that concept and they just have a one page or there's a directory of among like 30 pages, but yes, trustworthy. But if it's like why is every page here just full of links, you should avoid this.
Yeah. And then you had talked about like landing pages. I was cool. Cool. We'll look at both because I think I used to be called Blue-Ray page.
Yeah. landing pages landing pages are great when you're trying to optimize for specific keywords. So for example let's say someone was typing in like pizza versus pepperoni pizza. He didn't create a whole nother page just for pepperoni pizzas, the optimized for pepperoni pizza. So that would mean when you just come on, they can see a see a page more cater to the search term. I, I would recommend creating landing pages for only a high volume keywords like the phrase like we're talking about like don't try to create it for every single one. Just create it for like the five, 10 that, you know, make you a lot of money and then, and then that's good.
From what I understand, no, I don't, not at all. Yeah, because LinkedIn fall, it falls into the social media aspect. Yeah. Yeah. There is a correlation. Like the more active you are on LinkedIn, the more likely to be active on your website. But I would recommend against
Linkedin being your only strategy. We have media there, air paid media,
Time magazine. Casa falls in kind of, those kind of means that the reason why I don't focus on that is because we'd all love to be in those. And if you can't get on those, great. But
It's kind of difficult. Same thing though. Those links don't reciprocate. Yeah. Then all that passenger value. Yeah. So Google plus, does that help at all? No, no. None of the thoughts were made to do. Yeah. What about paying for PR? Should you pay for care?
Yeah, so that is something I've actually had my own discussions with the, the SEO community online about as well. For PR if you're going to pay for it, the, the general understanding is think about the PR PR PR you're doing, if you're just churning out press releases because of keywords, you're going to get penalized if you're putting out press releases because you have a new product launch or do you have an event coming up? That's okay. That's okay. You can pay for that if you, like. I tell the state have not paid for one. I am heavily considering it for a client,
But it just your intent, you're right
And if you write press releases with Goodwill and the flow of your business, then yeah, it makes a lot more sense. Yeah. Cool. So that's pretty much all I have for today. But I'm happy to answer any questions. I know there's so much out there of SEO, so
I'd be happy to whatever comes to your mind, I'd be happy to go over. Great. Thank you. Yeah.